Tegan and Ness' beauty counter

PSA: Urban Decay is coming to Mecca Maxima in March!!!

In other news, I actually got a proper reply from Beauty Bay overnight - the item went out of stock just before I ordered and they've cancelled that part of my order. Which is fine, it just would have been nice to get an email advising that rather than me having to ask!

I don't understand how that works. Surely their inventory is online and it says it's out of stock before you can click it?

I'm so sceptical about Urban Decay here... I'll have to do a trip to Sydney then and check it out, but I'm guessing their palettes will be $90 at least. So much.

Yeah all I can think is that I did sit there for ages with it in my cart before actually purchasing it. With other sites like a Black Milk, it recognises that something in your cart has become sold out and won't let you proceed, but maybe their site is different. Or maybe they're lying haha

Or maybe they're shit.

Ha, yep that's probably it. Luckily it was Too Faced so I can pick it up from Mecca, but still.

I am cautiously excited about Urban Decay. If they're too expensive, I can at least see the shades in real life before ordering online.

Klerr! wrote:I don't understand how that works. Surely their inventory is online and it says it's out of stock before you can click it?

Usually if things are out of stock it isn't always advertised. For example, if we're expecting a delivery of XYZ product you received to come in tomorrow, you're not going to even notice the difference if you placed your order today right? So it doesn't have an out of stock notification, because that puts people off ordering even though it makes no difference because your order wouldn't have been shipped until tomorrow anyway. So when whatever you ordered doesn't arrive in our shipment, because the supplier didn't have any or discontinued it or whatever, your order (which wasn't originally out of stock) now is. The only difference is NORMAL COMPANIES CONTACT CUSTOMERS TO TELL THEM THIS SHIT. Goddamn it, Beauty Bay.

So I got a Nars eyeshadow duo for Christmas - Kalahari, and it's amazeballs. So I bought Kuala Lumpur, and now it's basically my favourite thing. I will probably throw out all of my makeup and and just keep this.

As for the animal cruelty business. I swear recently Mecca said that they were committed to only selling brands that were cruelty free. The whole selling to china thing is a bit weird, because some companies say it doesn't effect the products being sold outside of china, but then the company is testing on animals somewhere.

I ended up buying the Too Faced Sweethearts blush in Candy Glow from Mecca and it's so pretty! I'm so glad I got it

Klerr! wrote:As for the animal cruelty business. I swear recently Mecca said that they were committed to only selling brands that were cruelty free. The whole selling to china thing is a bit weird, because some companies say it doesn't effect the products being sold outside of china, but then the company is testing on animals somewhere.

Yeah, and a lot of the companies don't conduct any of the testing themselves, it's all done by third parties, which is how I justified MAC to myself for the last six months; however the makeup companies have chosen to sell in China knowing full well that someone somewhere will conduct animal testing with their product to do so, so in my opinion it's just as bad. Like, I wouldn't beat a child, but I also wouldn't send a child somewhere I know for a fact it's going to be beaten and feel totally fine about that option.

That's my logic, anyway.

That makes sense Tash, because it shows they're more concerned with making money from the expanding Chinese middle class than upholding their apparent values against animal testing

Yes! A much more concise and easily understandable explanation of the point I was trying to make

I feel a bit uncomfortable asking this because I don't know how to ask it in the non-judgmental way I intend, but I an genuinely curious: what do those of you who actively choose cruelty-free products see as the difference between how animals are tortured in this way and how animals are tortured for food production and consumption? Is it a convenience thing (it's easier to change makeup products and just buy a lipstick from a different company then stop a lifetime habit or change a mindset you've grown up with) or is it the physical differences between the treatment (cages and very specific form of abuse, versus violence and steroids and removing babies from mothers etc)? Or is it both or neither of those things?

I'm in no way being critical, I think anyone who makes any decision to reduce the impact of harm on animals in their lives is making a wonderful decision and contributing in some way.

That's a really good question Sian.

I am not hugely I to makeup but do avoid companies that test on animals when I do buy stuff.
You pretty much banged (is that the right English?) the nail on the head with the convenience thing. It is much easier to avoid non essential cosmetic brands on a monthly basis, than face choosing non animal products on a couple of hourly basis.

As part of my life plan I would like to become a vegetarian, I feel like I would sleep better at night, but I am lazy and share meals with a meat eater so it's harder.
Basically I'm a shit person and also a lazy person.

No, the sharing meals thing is really hard to navigate, I don't think that makes you shit or lazy! I would definitely consume far less dairy if I didn't live with Murray. We have an entirely vegetarian household and always get our eggs from the local community farm where we know they're treated super well, but it just feels impossible to stop with the milk and cheese, and I really struggle with that. Overall I think by making the most ethical choices with the milk and cheese we do buy and by Murray not eating meat at all at home, I think we definitely still as two people living together do far less damage than if I were entirely vegan and he ate meat and we lived apart, so I try not to beat myself up about it too much. I think it's definitely something I'm working towards but you really need to be able to fully commit to it. I've been happily vegetarian for most of my life with no real hiccups and now it's been so long I have zero cravings for meat at all and feel confident I'll never eat it again (unless pregnancy gets really weird?) but I've seen friend after friend fall off the vegan wagon because it's just too hard for most people, and I really don't want to be one of those people. (Not that there's anything wrong with doing it for as long as you can and then reassessing and changing your diet again, I just want to stick to it once I go for it.)

That is a good question Sian and don't feel bad for asking at all. I feel like testing on animals is completely unnecessary and eventually a thing that can stop all together with enough pressure from consumers, but eating meat is something that humans have done for a very long time. I guess maybe it is a bit hypocritical though. I do have a lot of vegetarian days, never buy chicken unless it's free range, same for eggs (although I feel I need to look into that more because free range is a very loosely used term) and prefer soy milk for coffee. I feel like doing your best really is good enough and people shouldn't be judged if they eat a mostly vegan diet but occasionally have cheese, or heck, even fish. My sister is vegan but she's also coeliac and it's almost impossible to buy gluten free bread without egg in it.

We could talk about medical testing on animals too, but maybe that's a bit too much controversy.

I agree with Claire about animal testing being unnecessary, and that there are more ethical ways to farm and slaughter animals now. While I try to make two of my main meals vegetarian, I like the taste of meat simply. Plus being vegan/vegetarian and general selectiveness about diet is a very privileged thing that really is only present in Western countries and India but that is due to religion

Without wanting to start any sort of argument, I've simply never understood the "things are worse elsewhere so we shouldn't worry about the things that are bad in our country" analogy. I find it to be a thing people say as an excuse not to think about their involvement in things. Nobody thinks we shouldn't worry if our bosses pay us illegally just because the working class don't have the luxury of being able to rock the boats with their employers, right? I totally, totally agree with you that it is a privilege to be able to afford to care about the mistreatment of the animals we kill for food! People all over the world eat meat because its the cheapest way to feed their families, and that's awful, but I'm not sure what that has to do with my thinking it's wrong, in a middle-class Australian context where we can afford to not eat meat, to kill terrified animals in front of each other or tear babies away from their mothers who actually go mad with grief or who have to give birth to premature or stillborn calves in tiny pens where…I'm not even going to tell you guys what happens next in that particular scenario because it really messed me up when I found out. This is a really helpful and short and accessible article unpacking the "but what about the children starving in Africa" argument that crops up as a rebuttal when people speak up about any Western injustice ever: http://geo-geek.blogspot.com.au/2011/07/really-dont-use-this-argument.html

Also, it's worth noting that while there are way, way more ethical ways to farm and slaughter, those just simply aren't the methods being employed if you buy a general cut of meat in a supermarket. It *is* certainly possible to consume meat ethically or at least more ethically, and I'm sure there are people that only eat (expensive, hard to find) meat at home when they know how it's been produced and abstain from eating meat at restaurants. I would applaud those people!

I'm not quite sure where you got my statement about it being a privileged choice to equating to the argument of things are much worse in another place. I know where my meat comes from, I know it's an unpleasant process and don't pretend my meat just fell off an animal. There are negatives from all agriculture such as inefficient use of land, chemical runs off and the economic impacts of excessive farming subsidies.

Most people eat meat because they like the taste. I'm not going to pretend that I don't love bacon and other meat products. Meat makes up so many national dishes, for example whilst my mother is primarily vegetarian in accordance to her buddhist believes nearly all our family's favourite Malaysian food contains meat. Meat isn't the cheapest food source but the reason that overall meat consumption is growing is in line with the growing middle class in developing nations where meat was once a luxury

It's a good question, and one you shouldn't feel bad about asking. I've debated with myself on this matter countless times, and had the conversation with Amy and Ben a lot too, especially recently with them going fully vegan. I don't generally discuss this with anyone outside of family and my very best friends as it seems to have become as contentious a topic as politics and religion.

Basically, for me, I like meat. It tastes good and I feel it nourishes me. I also have no qualms about eating something that used to be alive. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. I am uncomfortable about unethically farmed meat, and I don't support factory-style farming, but personally I feel as long as I consume with a conscience, that's okay. I have a rather simplistic, perhaps naive view: all things die, why not eat them? If it weren't taboo to eat humans, for instance, I'd be fine with people eating me after my death. By that same logic, I am a donor. I have no problem with people taking my eyes and heart and whatnot once I'm dead - after all, I'll have no use for it. And by that same token, provided an animal has been well cared for and lived a good life, I have zero ethical dilemma about consuming it post-mortem. Humans have done so for centuries, and of course there is a large, loud argument now that we simply don't need to anymore, but regardless, we have done, we continue to do so and personally I'm happy to continue doing so. I don't have that thing where I think "cute little bunny rabbit, I could never eat you!" I genuinely do not see why if a rabbit dies I should bury it rather than eat it.

At its core, it is a primitive thing. A lion would have no qualms about eating me; likewise, I have no issue eating cow, and I'm sure if cows had predatory instincts they'd gobble me right up, too. I understand there are alternatives, I understand it's no longer necessary to my survival to eat meat; however, I like meat, so I continue to eat it. That said, I do so with a conscience - I buy free range meat and eggs, organic where possible. All supermarkets in New Zealand stock free range options, so they're not hard to come by, and a lot of the time there is literally zero price difference, which is why I'm astounded by people who continue to support cruel farming methods. If you can buy free range for the same price, why give your money to the wankers who factory farm pigs? Why not support Freedom Farms? I bought bacon last weekend and the Freedom Farms bacon was literally the exact same price, to the cent, as the factory farmed stuff. That I do not understand. Although, having said that, we eat at cheap restaurants occasionally where I can say with almost absolute certainty they do not use free range meat. So we're not perfect. But that's really no different to Amy and Ben being "vegan" but still drinking Bailey's at Christmas and driving a BMW station wagon with full leather interior.

There are so many arguments for veganism, and from a purely holistic standpoint I agree with it wholeheartedly, but at the same time I am an animal and I enjoy getting nourishment from other animals. I know this isn't morally sound and comes across as ignorant to people who have decided to take the higher ground and engage in no animal harm whatsoever, but truthfully, I'm not bothered by that. I'm comfortable with my lifestyle. I take what steps I can - I only eat free range (this includes with fast food; since moving to Auckland we almost exclusively buy Burgerfuel when we fancy a greasy treat, because they use strictly free range products only) and buy cruelty free products. To answer your original question, I do so because there is zero need to test cosmetics on animals. None whatsoever. And it comes back to that basic principle for me; while I choose to eat meat, I do so consciously, and where possible to avoid or reduce harm, I do so. Same goes for cosmetics. There is just no need for me to buy L'Oreal lipstick when I could get Lime Crime for the same price and know I've put my money to a more ethical organisation in the process.

As for veganism vs. vegetarianism; personally, I think going fully vegan is a really extreme step to take, and I too have seen people do so only to fail 12 or 18 months down the track. My good friend Tessa was vegan for two years and has recently gone back to being vegetarian, because of cakes. She was in a cafe one day and suddenly felt completely fed up with avoiding cake. She wanted a slice of chocolate cake, so she got it, and she's been firmly vegetarian since. She said sure, the vegan thing was good while it lasted, but ultimately she just does not see a huge problem with butter or honey, so she's eating them again. She still doesn't eat eggs, because she thinks the idea of eating a chicken's period is gross, but she's no longer hardcore vegan and said her mental state is so much clearer as a result. She feels calmer, freer and less stressed.

Amy and Ben are persisting with the vegan thing, but make concessions for treats like biscuits, cake and Baileys, which I think defeats the purpose altogether. If you're going to be so high and mighty as to say you are vehemently against even the idea of having pets, then you can't be like, "Oh, but biscuits are okay, because biscuits." Either you consume animal products or you don't, and by saying you don't but then changing the rules to suit your own taste buds is, I think, the most perfect example of human greed, and if anything simply proving the point they've been trying to disprove all along. It's like Julia at my work, who doesn't eat pork because they're "too much like humans", but is fine with eating other animals. That, to me, is the quintessential example of human superiority. "I won't eat pigs, because they are as intelligent as humans, but the other animals are dumb, so they're fine." Likewise, I disagree with vegetarians who avoid animals they feel they could form a bond with (cute lambs, cows, pigs, etc) but happily eat fish and seafood because they view them as emotionless.

So, it'd be really nice if my Beauty Bay order posted 22nd January would show up some time soon...

F*cking hell, my order never showed up. Two weeks ago today I emailed to follow up and they submitted a lost item claim with Australia Post. Yesterday I emailed asking where it was at and today they said they've processed a refund for me. Don't think I'll order from Beauty Bay again!

On the weekend I bought lots of Too Faced stuff, including the Chocolate Bar palette which is amazing! But I also got the La Creme lipstick in Nude Beach and it's the perfect nude shade and feels so nice...so I ordered three more colours online, oops.

So, Urban Decay is now in Australia! I think on Monday I'll go to my local Mecca Maxima (when it isn't so busy) and have a play. I was really looking forward to being able to buy Revolution lipstick, but judging by the website they don't stock it - only the sheer one, not the original which is much brighter. Oh well, now I've decided that when I'm in Europe I'll have to stock up at Sephora or something.

It's probably cheaper to get things in Australia than sephora in Europe, especially eith the exchange rate. I can't believe Perth has a Mecca Maxima and we don't. Stupid canberra is stupid.